How secure is safe?

[Gilbert]

I would like to know how you here think about this.

As we all know securing servers and networks is not an easy job to do, personal i think it is impossible to close out all vulnerabilities with an open network as the internet, but ok, it is possible to make it as difficult as possible.

But is it safe to secure governmental networks so no one can come in anymore?

What i mean is this, in an country like the Netherlands the government is managing to keep the corruption and crimes they commit covert up and secret, it is not the kind of corruption we know here, but there it is about child rape, child murders, murders, tortures, fraud and molesting which are committed by law enforcement and the justice department. With intimidation's, bringing in discredit and destruction of people they manage to keep the corruption covert up. This even reaches till the EU counsel and the EU court of human rights. Sending emails to NGO organisations is often intercepted by the government.

When you make networks real secure then such criminal governments became impossible to monitor, and the end is out of sight. You can say then that an safe network or server becomes unsafe for the population. On the other hand, an unsecured network is unsafe because the information that must be protected is open to air. How wishful is it then to secure governmental networks?

[em]

First remark.

You are talking about the corruption in Netherlands. Please take a look at this table[1]. Your country is fucking clean.

Secondly, you are assuming that the secret services are leaving written or electronic proof about their own corruption. I find that highly unlikely. Why would they document their own dirty laundry?

On the other hand, an unsecured network is unsafe because the information that must be protected is open to air.

I really do believe that they classify publicly disclosed information but that's not always the case. They do need to classify some information for your own protection. How would you feel if you knew that there's a 50% chance of a terrorist attack on the subway that you use it on a daily basis?

In regards to the security of the government networks, they need to be secure BUT the thought of jail keep people away from them.

[1] - 2012 Corruption Perceptions Index -- Results

[Gilbert]

Well not realy, Transparency is under dutch influence, the statutes are even signed in Nijmegen in the Netherlands. Further more, Transparency doesnt underbuilt there statistics. It is obvisious an politic institute that got not so much to do with reality. Compared with the Netherlands Romania are amateurs when it is about corruption. I can say that because i investigated an lot from that country.

I am not specially talking about an secret service, but governmental networks in common. For sure corruption must use those networks to.

There is always an 50% chance on an terrorist attack anywhere, but international terrorism is not so active as in the '70 and '80. But that is an other subject.

What i mean is where must we keep the balance so it keeps safe.

[Gilbert]

btw, are you an dutch official by accident? Because they always refer to Transparancy in there first alinea.

[TheTime]

Gilbert, don't make double posts on this forum, we don't like that.

About this topic, I think that secured networks are always to be desired, even if we talk about a monster-like government. Why? Because there is a need for privacy everywhere, because some things are just not meant to be public.

There are other ways to reveal their dark secrets and I don't believe that hacking for justice is a solution.

[em]

@Offtopic

I am not a dutch official. Transparency gave me the most recent results about corruption index.

Compared with the Netherlands Romania are amateurs when it is about corruption.

Please dude. Romania payed $1.2 billion dollars for 10 km of unfinished highway, $3 million for 3 fishing boats (marked as fighting boats) and sold almost all the state owned industry as an exchange coin for joining EU or NATO. Don't talk me about corruption. Here you have to bribe a medic to even considering letting you in a hospital, bribe the check man in trains to let you ride it and with enough money, police will never bother you.

I think you are talking about high-level corruption. That's present in all the countries. But believe me, here is worse.

[Gilbert]

@The Time: I am sorry, i was not aware i made an double post here.

I agree with you that privacy is an need to protect an individual, economy and even an whole continent. But these days with foreingh countries who can look in our bank systems, facebook that connects to everything and everybody privacy is far to seek, and with that the protection from privacy. I even dare to say that because of the lac on privacy the EU will never come out of the euro crises because the competition can look inside our cards but we cant look in there cards. The US will never ever give the EU an connection to there bank system. Of course they say it is to search for terrorist money transfers, but it is opvisious that after every EU top, there comes an reaction out of the US and the whole EU top was for nothing again.

@EM: Ow that is nothing, in the Netherlands you got the Chipshol case as example, well there we talk about many more billions then that 1,2 billion. And when it is about bribe then you can realy learn from an party like the VVD, those are more active with amounts like 800.000 euro. And they sold the public companies to for an apple and an egg to foreingh countries, they call that privatesising. But in the Netherlands it goes an bit further, there you got also pedophile networks and drugs organisations inside the government. To find an honest judge in that country is an pin in an minefield. You realy look to bright to that country, it is not so nice as the propaganda want you to be leave. And NGO's are not so reliable as you think, they want to earn an penny to you know. If you realy want to know about corruption there then i can always help you on lots of information about that.

[Gilbert]

There are other ways to reveal their dark secrets and I don't believe that hacking for justice is a solution.

Well, in an country like Germany, law enforcement does hack for justice, but you can ask the question then how reliable is evidence that come from computers that hang on the internet. I wrote about that earlier. But media who got an controlling function in an democratie, don't have sights on everything to monitor governments. So corruption is made then very easy if corruption is protected. So there is to find an balance between transparency from the government and the protection of privacy.